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  #11  
Old 07-25-2005
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Default Gas info

Gas, as good and humane as it is, is definitely not for under 4 months / pregnant. Not only because it is illegal in NC, but also because in the case of under 4 months, the animals metabolism is much faster. The body can process the CO gas through the system at a faster rate, so it takes much longer for the gas to reach a fatal level in the blood. The same applies to pregnant. the mother will pass quickly, but will take much longer for the babies (leaving them there to suffer.) This info was given to us by the Vet thet certified us, after he demonstrated his "portable gas chamber" that he takes with him to classes.
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  #12  
Old 07-25-2005
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Thanks for all the great info.
That is the same thing I was taught about 4 months and younger, sick, injured, old and so on.
I cannot find specific law that state such. The only thing is under NC GS 130A-192. http://www.ncleg.net/EnactedLegislat..._130A-192.html
But the argument at this new job is that we do not pick up the animals for lack of rabies tag, so it does not apply to the animals we euthanize, including strays, owner surrender, born at shelter, etc. We do not even keep the records they say as the animals we have are not obtained under this law.
Don't know about any one else, but I sure do not want to be cruel to any animal. If I had specific law I could show that we are in violation of NC Law, maybe I would have a chance of getting some changes made, that would make things better for the animals.
Thanks again for everyones help and input.
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  #13  
Old 07-26-2005
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This is a tricky subject in NC--mostly because of the way that the current law is worded ("If the animal is not reclaimed by its owner during the impoundment period, the animal shall be disposed of in one of the following manners: returned to the owner; adopted as a pet by a new owner; sold to institutions within this State registered by the United States Department of Agriculture pursuant to the Federal Animal Welfare Act, as amended; or put to death by a procedure approved by the American Veterinary Medical Association, the Humane Society of the United States or of the American Humane Association.")

HSUS says no old, sick, under 4 mos., injured or pregnant (I'm paraphrasing, obviously), which leaves only healthy adult animals as possible/conditionally acceptable candidates for CO, IF you choose HSUS guidelines.

AVMA says nothing under 4 mos., but it is vague as to pregnant animals. AVMA's position is much broader in scope than HSUS.

As for American Humane, since that law was written, they no longer consider CO to be acceptable at all.

So, what you have is a law that cites 3 organizations, one of which no longer agrees with the other 2 on CO, and 2 of which vary in their recommendations. Most counties in NC seem to choose AVMA so that the criteria will be minimal (or at least less stringent than HSUS), but even if they do this, they must have an alternative method available (hopefully EBI) for those animals under 4 mos. In other words, neither organization condones CO for ALL animals.

There is a big, long, history behind all of this--but the bottom line is that the rabies law is the only one that currently mandates a method of euth. There was quite a bit of legislative acitivity in this regard as well as other aspects such as shelter care standards last year. You might want to contact BB Knowles in NC who is president of NC Voters for Animal Welfare to see where the legislation is at presently. Her e-mail address is bbkchowsky@earthlink.net.

NC was in my region for many years, but is now served by the HSUS Southeast Regional Office. I encourage you to contact them for further info at jhobgood@hsus.org & lbevan@hsus.org; 850-386-3435. Good luck to you!

Jenny Brown/HSUS Central States Regional Office (jbrown@hsus.org)
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  #14  
Old 07-26-2005
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I should have included in my previous post that both HSUS and AVMA have descriptions for what is considered an appropriate chamber (again, HSUS is a little more stringent). Many counties in NC are still using old, leaky chambers (some are homemade) that do not allow for proper separation of animals and, quite frankly, could be dangerous to those people that are exposed to them. There is only one major manufacturer left in the U.S. that sells commercially-manufactured units (AAI). I know of one NC county that purchased a unit a couple of years ago, and it cost them around $12,000 or $14,000.

You might want to take a look at AVMA's Panel Report on Euth. from 2000 at http://avma.org/resources/euthanasia.pdf. Additionally, both HSUS and AVMA agree (although HSUS states it more emphatically) that euth. by injection, when done properly, is the fastest, least expensive and most humane method.

If counties are still using CO, we urge them to follow HSUS recommendations, which I'll be happy to provide if you would like the info. I would normally just refer you to www.animalsheltering.org, but we are redoing the site and are currently updating our euthanasia statement, so I'm not sure if it is online yet.
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  #15  
Old 07-26-2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wonderpup
But the argument at this new job is that we do not pick up the animals for lack of rabies tag, so it does not apply to the animals we euthanize, including strays, owner surrender, born at shelter, etc. We do not even keep the records they say as the animals we have are not obtained under this law.
If you are impounding the animal, you are subject to follow the Rabies Law in NC (which is the link that you referenced).
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  #16  
Old 07-27-2005
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Hey everyone

When you guys are talking about injection..do you mean IV injection or where they inject the lethal fluid into their hearts.

The spca that I used to work for of course sedated first, but they (and us ACO's) would do the injection right into the heart. First you would feel for the heart beat and once you found it, you then would inject the needle, pull up to see if blood filled up abit in the syergine (so you know you where in the heart) and then inject.

What is everyone's view on injection into the heart? How many of you's use this method? Take it easy!

Sunny
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  #17  
Old 07-27-2005
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Default This about that

Intracardiac (IC) or heart sticks should only be done on a comatose or fully anesthetized animal where no regular vein cannot be found. This is also the case in some very young, very old, and critically injured animals. In some states, these are legally prohibitted.

Regular IV injection is just that - IntraVeneous and can be done with the animal alert (although my preference is sedated) in any of the veins in the legs.

IP or IntraPeritoneal (my spelling is way off today!) is another method but again best done on a sedated or anesthetized animals.

NACA offers an excellent course on this. Others are available from HSUS and many State Veterinarians. I encourage you to go to the websites and get this information or PM me for some other areas to check.
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  #18  
Old 07-27-2005
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Thanks Mark for the info

The spca that I use to work for did the inrcardiac on all animals, very young, young, old, very old and critically injured. They were sedated..but not fully. I honestly think that they used these method because of conveince, easy to train anyone on how to do it and it was quick.

I personally did not like this method and honestly in my opinion find that this method is one of the most inhumane methods you can use. But I have talked to people and they think that I'am wrong and say that this is one of the humane methods. . What is your opinion?

At least if you are doing an IV inject, (even if the the animal is sadated), they can still feel you poking at the vien and yes it is uncomfortable... but i think it is less painful, stressfull and uncomfortable, than to be poking around the heart more then once, making sure that you have the heart. You know what I'm saying.

Sunny

I will check out the sites that you gave me.
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  #19  
Old 07-27-2005
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Your thoughts on convenience are more accurate than more humane. IC is not in the vein (unless you consider the heart a REALLY big vein) I do not think being "stabbed" in the heart sounds like much fun at all. Unless you are completely stage five sedated. Again, get the info from the major orgs.

Go with the IV...
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  #20  
Old 07-28-2005
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Mark,

I think you misunderstood my post. Correct me if I'm wrong. I am calling the IC an INhumane method. ALso, I didn't call the heart a vein and I know it is not. I'm saying I think it is more painful injecting into the heart, rather than injecting into the vein.. I think it is applauling that they would half ass PTS's, just so anyone can do it. You should be making the animals death as quick and comfortable as possible....In the most Humane way. Where did I state that being stabbed in the heart was fun? I think it is inhumane and cruel method. I prefer the IV method myself. Take it easy

Sunny
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"The greatness of a nation and it's moral progress can be judged by the way it's animals are treated".

"Saving just one pet won't change the world, but, surely the world will change for that one pet." You might be the only love they know in their life.

Just when the caterpillar thought the world was over, it became a butterfly

You can either be the cure or the disease.
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