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Old 02-02-2012
halfacop halfacop is offline
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Default Firearms Question - All ACO's Please Read

Gang,

I know we have had this conversation in the past in relationship to who carries firearms on duty for their department...

What makes this different is I am requesting that you PM me with the City / Department you work for. I am working with my Deputy Chief in trying to gather some "facts" reference simliar departments and such. City / Location information will not be shared here with anyone and will not be linked to you in anyway - I promise that. I just need some numbers to help sway corprate council and the like.

I would be most appreciative if I could get any and all of you that DO CARRY firearms for your agency to PM me your department / city.

Help a brother out!

Half
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Old 02-02-2012
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Are you talking firearms such as a shotgun in the truck or firearms as in a glock on the hip?
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Old 02-03-2012
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PM sent.....best of luck
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Old 02-03-2012
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Firearms as in - Sidearms on the duty belt.

Awesome Info fyrdawg207 - thanks a ton!

Half
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Old 02-03-2012
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I think you need to narrow your information to the state in which you work. As you mentioned, this issue has come up a dozen times, and the laws and option vary greatly from state to state.
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Old 02-03-2012
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Not my agencies but the SPCA investigators in Syracuse, Rochester NY carry firearms
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Old 02-03-2012
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Half,

I hope the info helps and feel free to contact me for any more info.

Fyr
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Old 02-03-2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Getting too old View Post
I think you need to narrow your information to the state in which you work. As you mentioned, this issue has come up a dozen times, and the laws and option vary greatly from state to state.

No - I already know whats going on here in my state. I am looking for further on other departments.

I can say and elaborate that as stated - I am only interested in Sidearms not truck guns. I am already scheduled to go to the acadamy along with my partner. We are the Two Sgt / Investigators for our department who serve warrants and back up our officers.

We are now trying to gather info so that we can perhaps expand this opportunity to the officers on the street which certainly needs to be done. I worked for 5 years in MI and was basically no different than a deputy sheriff. Coming here was great but has sucked due to not having all the "tools" I was use to...

So we just want to have our ducks in a row when we present it to the Public Safety Director and Corprate Council....
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Old 02-03-2012
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In some states ACO is covered under the umbrella of things like park rangers, or already has some kind of peace officer connotation attached so all that is needed is a policy change. In Texas we are generally civilian employees, just like a receptionist or a records clerk. Even our authority to issue citations will vary from city to city.

As far as my staff, I have been through firearms training at a previous city, so Iím comfortable and safe with firearms. One of my ACOs, with training, might be safe to let loose on the general public with a firearm, but the other I canít even trust with a can of OC. Of all the ACOs I know, very few are even interested in being armed, and many of them would be far more dangerous with a gun than anything they would ever face in the field.

On the other hand, I met a county ACO at a conference once, and that is a whole other issue. Tarrant County has no animal control service, so everybody I know is municipal, and I hadnít even thought about county work environment. Out there you might be the only good guy for 50 miles, and when you walk up on some crack dealerís porch because of a complaint on their Pit, you could easily disappear and never been seen again. So yes, anybody in a rural setting needs to have self-defense training and be armed.

But on the third hand, it took the state of Texas 20 years to change the law and allow us to carry a bite stick. Our state association fought against the change for years because an ACO with an ASP was not the image they wanted to present to the public. The chances of getting the law changed to allow an ACO to carry a gun is not very hopeful. Even after the bite stick law was changed, and I went to the certification course, it was almost a year before the city would let us have bite sticks due to liability concerns. Even if the law allowed it, many cities would never arm their ACOs for the same reason.
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Old 02-03-2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Getting too old View Post
In some states ACO is covered under the umbrella of things like park rangers, or already has some kind of peace officer connotation attached so all that is needed is a policy change. In Texas we are generally civilian employees, just like a receptionist or a records clerk. Even our authority to issue citations will vary from city to city.

As far as my staff, I have been through firearms training at a previous city, so Iím comfortable and safe with firearms. One of my ACOs, with training, might be safe to let loose on the general public with a firearm, but the other I canít even trust with a can of OC. Of all the ACOs I know, very few are even interested in being armed, and many of them would be far more dangerous with a gun than anything they would ever face in the field.

On the other hand, I met a county ACO at a conference once, and that is a whole other issue. Tarrant County has no animal control service, so everybody I know is municipal, and I hadnít even thought about county work environment. Out there you might be the only good guy for 50 miles, and when you walk up on some crack dealerís porch because of a complaint on their Pit, you could easily disappear and never been seen again. So yes, anybody in a rural setting needs to have self-defense training and be armed.

But on the third hand, it took the state of Texas 20 years to change the law and allow us to carry a bite stick. Our state association fought against the change for years because an ACO with an ASP was not the image they wanted to present to the public. The chances of getting the law changed to allow an ACO to carry a gun is not very hopeful. Even after the bite stick law was changed, and I went to the certification course, it was almost a year before the city would let us have bite sticks due to liability concerns. Even if the law allowed it, many cities would never arm their ACOs for the same reason.
Well its nice to see that the short sightedness doesn't end here - misery loves company if you know what I am saying...

As I said - in the county I was "fully certified". GLOCK, Shotty, arrest powers for animal related offenses and everything we wrote for was a 90 day misdemeanor. This was in a rural / country county made of mostly farmers and some small towns.

Here in Indy we are obviously straight up city. We deal with thousands of neglect cases and abandonments which can often times lead up to the dogs simply being left in a stash house guarding said owners drugs, guns and cash. We are certified to carry OC and Baton (Yes a BATON) not a bite stick. This term irritates the hell out of me....LOL

We have a couple independant agencies within our borders and a couple county agencies next door that issue tasers and firearms as well. We're the biggest agency in the state but yet we don't have those tools yet....

We trip our way thru alleys on sweeps and have come upon dog fighting in progress and the like. We are constantly being charged at and from behind my the copius amounts of stray dogs which often time are simply the loosers that are let go from the dog fights last night.

Needless to say - along with all the warrants we serve - we should not be unarmed at any level in my agency. ACO's here were armed for ahwile back on the early 90's I think.

The day of the "Dog Catcher" is over my friends. Agency's that refuse to see this and send their men and woman out into the "fight" without the correct tools are simple idiots who will end up paying a settlement when someone gets whacked.

The "clients" that I work with see a uniform and don't take the moment to check and see if your the People PoPo or the Animal PoPo and ac accordingly.....
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